A conversation with Tammy Alvarez, CEO of Career Winner's Circle. Tammy is a mission-based founder with a relentless passion for helping leaders move faster as they strive to make a bigger impact. If you would like a financial plan to support you as you rethink and reimagine the next chapter of your life please schedule a call: https://trueabundanceadvisors.com/lets-connect
Tammy Alvarez, CEO of Career Winners Circle, is an award-winning entrepreneur, author, and inspirational coach. With decades of C-suite experience, Tammy blends a pragmatic, results-driven coaching style to help leaders unlock their full potential. Her book, Escaping the Career Trap, Transform your Apathy into Ambition and Never Hate Mondays Again, offers a blueprint for high achievers seeking career fulfillment.
Tammy shares her inspiring journey from a challenging childhood, including a period of homelessness, to becoming a successful corporate executive and entrepreneur. She recalls the early stages of her career, including her first job at Manpower as a recruiter and salesperson, and the invaluable support of her first boss. She highlights essential skills like humor, transparency, and humility that helped her build trust and overcome imposter syndrome.
Tammy emphasizes the importance of continuously reassessing personal and career goals, having a financial safety net, and the value of stepping out of one's comfort zone. Within the episode, she discusses negotiating compensation, understanding personal value, and approaching career growth with a business mindset.
“We all have seasonality. And I think there's been so many things in our lives over the past ten years that have caused us to rethink what good looks like, what success is, challenging the status quo, that if we don't continually check into the seasonality of our lives and our careers and make sure you're running the right race, because you work really hard to get wherever you're going. And, as we know, it's just really disheartening when you get there and you realize, oh, this is not what I wanted after all. “ - Tammy Alvarez
Key takeaways:
- What you thought was your achilles heel may actually be your superpower! As Tammy moved up the corporate ladder, she began to hide from others that, as she described it, was a country girl who hadn’t attended college. She had imposter syndrome before it became a thing! Over time, she came to realize that the fact that she saw things differently and wasn’t afraid to have the hard conversations was actually why she was so valued.
- Make sure you have a Plan B, which includes an emergency fund. Tammy stayed with her first employer for nine years, taking on more and more responsibility. She was in her second job for six months when the boss she loved left and she was let go. She and her husband had no savings cushion. Luckily, she was bailed out by the strong job market, but she learned her lesson to always have a Plan B and backup emergency funds.
- If you don’t like it, change it. Tammy shared that she sought to find passion in three different ways: in the work she was doing; in the people that she led and served, and in her own growth and development. When none of those were accessible, then it was time to make a move, which she wasn’t afraid to do.
About the guest:
Tammy Alvarez is the CEO of the Career Winners Circle and is also an author, professional keynote speaker, inspirational coach, trainer, and epic storyteller. As an award-winning entrepreneur and former corporate executive, Tammy believes leaders who inspire courage are at the heart of every successful business.
Her spirited “Break All the Rules” approach blends decades of C-Suite experience with a pragmatic, results-based coaching style that helps business professionals create a big impact and love every Monday again.
Her recent book Escaping The Career Trap, Transform Your Apathy into Ambition and Never Hate Mondays Again is a self-leadership blueprint for high achievers who want to experience true career fulfillment.
Tammy has an unwavering commitment to advancing ambitious business leaders so they can grow their careers as far as their drive will take them. She is the creator of the Career Success Blueprint – the ultimate executive career strategy framework, Own Your Power! – a pragmatic approach to advancing women leaders, and the CEO Advantage – helping small business owners scale without killing themselves in the process.
During her twenty-year corporate career, Tammy became renowned as a business transformation and turnaround expert on Wall Street. Her roles included Managing Director at AIG, First Senior Vice President at Bank Leumi USA, Chief Operating Officer at Genesis10, and Senior Vice President at Bank of America.
Tammy delivers epic keynote speeches for companies worldwide and has been a colloquium lecturer on various leadership topics at Cornell University. She holds a degree in International Business Administration from American Intercontinental University.
Tammy and her partner Steve have adopted an ex-pat lifestyle and enjoy traveling to far-flung places around the globe to hike and scuba dive. They currently reside in Mexico City.
Website: https://careerwinnerscircle.com/
Website: https://escapingthecareertrap.com/
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tammyalvarez/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/CareerWinnersCircle
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/careerwinnerscircle/
Purchase the book: Escaping The Career Trap, Transform Your Apathy into Ambition and Never Hate Mondays Again
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Disclaimer: Please remember that the information shared on this podcast does not constitute accounting, legal, tax, investment or financial advice. It’s for informational purposes only. You should seek appropriate professional advice for your specific information.
Tammy Alvarez
We all have seasonality. And I think there's been so many things in our lives over the past 10 years that have caused us to rethink what good looks like, what success is challenging the status quo, that if we don't continually check into the seasonality of our lives and our careers and make sure you're running the right race.
Because you work really hard to get wherever you're going. And as we, you know, it's just really disheartening when you get there and you realize, Oh, this is not what I wanted after all.
Narrator
Welcome to making change with your money. A podcast that highlights the stories and strategies of women who experienced a big life transition and overcame challenges as they redefined financial success for themselves.
Now here's your host certified financial planner. Laura Rotter.
Laura Rotter
I am so excited to have as my guest today, Tammy Alvarez. Tammy is the CEO of the Career Winners Circle and is also an author, professional keynote speaker, inspirational coach, trainer, and epic storyteller. As an award winning entrepreneur and former corporate executive, Tammy is the CEO of Tammy believes leaders who inspire courage are at the heart of every successful business.
Her recent book, escaping the career trap, transform your apathy into ambition and never hate Mondays again is a self leadership blueprint for high achievers who want to experience true career fulfillment. So welcome Tammy to the making change with your money podcast.
Tammy Alvarez
Thank you. It's such a pleasure to be here, Laura.
Looking forward to our conversation today.
Laura Rotter
Yes. And especially that quote, never hate Mondays again. So speaks to me. I think we both were in the soul crushing ground for a while back in the day.
Tammy Alvarez
Right. And yes. Yes. How debilitating it is until you get out and you're like, Oh wait, this is so much more fun.
Laura Rotter
Exactly. So I'm going to start with the question I always start with, which was Tammy, what was money like in your family growing up?
Tammy Alvarez
That's a short answer. There wasn't any.
So I, you know, growing up, we were, what I thought was, you know, a middle class family. And, you know, we didn't live lavishly. We never went out to dinner. We didn't really go on vacations very often, but we didn't want for anything either, you know, and I never realized how much money we didn't have. Until I was older and when I was 15, my parents had divorced and that wasn't a big deal.
It seemed to be all the rage at the time. However, a few months after my parents had split up, my mom, my sister and I became homeless and it was traumatic, which is an understatement. And to see how much my mom struggled because she had gotten pregnant with me in high school. And so she never graduated.
And she had supported my father and his business and my sister and I, and so she was not equipped to handle the struggles that this massive abruption in life had dealt us. And, um, and so that had a profound impact, impact on my point of view and relationship of money, you know, from a very, very young age in terms of, you know, my teenage and my formidable years.
Laura Rotter
I can imagine that that, I don't want to put words in your mouth. It could go either way. You could either follow your mother's footsteps or you can just be adamant that you are never going to suffer in that way.
Tammy Alvarez
And that was the jet pack. That was the fuel I needed. I, when I talked to people about, you know, ambition and taking risks and really stepping into the things that light you up, I use, Seeing what my mom went through as like my ambition was filled with fear for a long time And then I did not want that to be me and I didn't get my college degree until I was 40 Because by the time I was 15 when this all happened, so by the time it was time to choose colleges You know at that point my grades were terrible.
I had no ambition and we had no money And so I decided I was just gonna go work Get myself together for a few years and then go back, but then I kept getting promoted and I had this amazing You know good fortune of having mentors in my life that saw more in me than I did Because all I saw was a small country girl that never traveled never went to college didn't have all these big world experiences But what I did have is I was fearless Because I played like I had nothing to lose because for a very, very long time, I didn't, I had nothing to lose.
My idea was if I was a data entry operator, then that was success. I was good. And, you know, it turns out, you know, a C level executive on Wall Street, if you're, you know, 20 years later. So we moved past those aspirations just a little bit, but that early recognition that I needed to be able to be independent and I needed to have that level of financial security came in a way that most people don't fortunately have, you know, have to experience.
Laura Rotter
Yes. There's a, a lot to unpack there, Tammy. So I want to start, first of all, where were you living when your parents got divorced?
Tammy Alvarez
Yeah. So I was in Northern New Jersey. In a, uh, a small dairy town called Sussex County, there were more dairy cows than people, you know, all two lane roads. Yes, still things haven't changed much, although I got out of there as fast as I could, you know, and so it was, that was where we grew up.
It was a small town. Everyone knew everybody. It was a community. And so, because everyone knew everyone, you know, many people knew what was happening and on the, you know, the bright side. We had support, you know, on the downside as a teenage girl, it was mortifying, right, in terms of kind of going, going through that and whatnot.
It was definitely left an impression, that's for sure. Yeah, so.
Laura Rotter
And you've referred to it a couple of times as you were a country girl, you grew up in a small town. What was your first job? What, what did you do when you decided, okay, no money for college. I'm going to start working. I'm going to do something right.
Tammy Alvarez
I'm going to do something. And I had worked in high school anyway, like as a bank teller, you know, okay. As a cashier, you know, at A& P, you know, back in the day. And, but what my first real job was is I was a, I worked for Manpower, the temporary services agency on the light industrial desk as a recruiter and salesperson.
So we would place day laborers and warehouse workers and production people in companies on a temporary basis. And so I would work with the customers that we already had to go out there and meet the people and see the environment. And then I would work with applicants as they would come in and apply.
And then every day we would be You know, physically with the files, because you could still smoke at your desk at that time, right? So I'm dating myself a little bit here. You know, we would just go through the files and find people who would take those assignments. And, uh, and that's what I did. And I worked for, it was in South Jersey, and I had worked for a franchise owner who owned franchises in the Philadelphia and the Cherry Hill area.
And, uh, Marty Klein,
I'm totally dating myself now. And like, here I am, 19 years old, I can't find my, you know, you know what from my elbow, but I'm willing to try anything and make mistakes and keep going. And so from that standpoint, that early indoctrination to taking risks, trying new things, kind of rubbing, you know, just, Dealing with the failure, you know, leaning into the success and continuing to try again, like all of that was lessons that I was learning when I didn't even know that I was learning, right?
And that it was a thing. So yeah, it was very interesting.
Laura Rotter
I hear, Tammy, your gratitude that's unparalleled. You metaphor I've used, frankly, about my own career at one point that someone gave you enough rope to potentially hang yourself, right. That enabled you to challenge yourself and take risks. I'd love to hear your thoughts about yourself and what skills.
You brought to the table that helped you not hang yourself when the rope is given. I know you've already said that you didn't have fear, if you will, because you had already faced one of the most frightening things and lived through it. But what else about you enabled you to step up?
Tammy Alvarez
The things that I think worked really well for me were my natural ability to find humor in almost everything.
And help other people see the humor too, because I think Unknowingly, and again, hindsight's always 20 20, when people are in high stakes situations from a business perspective, they tend to put themselves in these life or death situations. And I've just naturally never taken anything that seriously. And so I was able to come in, in these really stressful situations and, and lighten the mood and just get people to rally around perspective.
And I think that built trust very quickly. So, cause when I look back and I think about it and I'm like, okay, so if I'm outside looking in and I'm this 19 year old, no nothing who is now collaborating with, you know, 30 and 40 year old leaders and trying to get them to do something new, trying to get them to move in a direction, they did it.
And they had no reason to. And so, with that collaboration, and the humor, and the trust building, and just being very human, I think the other thing I was accidentally learned is that transparency and humility was very helpful for me. Because I didn't pretend to know anything because I didn't. Right? I was always willing to get new ideas because I wasn't sure what to do.
So I'm like, okay, my first start with everything that I did that was new was asking everybody else what they thought. Like, how would you do this if you were me? And then getting their points of view. So that allowed me to fast track my points of view very quickly. But what I didn't realize at the time, it was also my peers, their fingerprints were on every solution.
And so because they were part of the process, The adoption was much easier and much faster.
Laura Rotter
I really love that. And you're looking back and identifying it, right?
Tammy Alvarez
Back in the early days, right? And those are skills that had stuck with me forever, you know, that I was building just kind of accidentally.
Laura Rotter
Yeah, that you're a collaborator. I would assume to work with people in the way you did, you've always. enjoyed people.
Tammy Alvarez
Yes, absolutely.
Laura Rotter
And I want to point out to you that certainly someone else in the same situation, perhaps young and feeling inexperienced, could just barrel through and almost choose the opposite of what you just described, which is, I don't want people to recognize that I've never done this before, so I'm just gonna push.
Tammy Alvarez
Oh, yes. And that it came naturally to you to collaborate and to. Bring humility, and I hope you appreciate that.
When I made the move to Wall Street, then the stakes were much higher. And then I almost flipped my persona, and then I did not want people to know that I was a country girl. I did not want people to know I hadn't gone to college and all these other things, because I had to play bigger.
And so I know, you know, the collaboration and the humor and all that stuff is always just part of who I am. So I can't undo those things. But I played things, the further up I got, You know, after my first role, which I was in that first role for nine years. So I had a great learning and launch pad. And then I started to actually be much more mindful in how I showed up and how I presented myself because I didn't want to be seen as what I was.
And so I feel like I was living the imposter syndrome long before it was a thing and being able to figure out how to navigate that and realize, I think one of the most powerful things that I realized probably too late in my career was that my superpower was the fact that I was different. And I thought it was my Achilles heel.
So I spent so much time minimizing the thing That was my best asset. And I'll never forget the moment that that happened. I was working for a financial services company. It was during one of the financial crisis. There was plenty in my career. I was in an office with a very, very senior executive and I needed something done in the EU.
And he oversaw that area. And he didn't like it. And so we were in a cage match. We were literally screaming at each other. It was ridiculous. And that's just how we communicated. And so I was terrified. I was like big. I'm like, I'm doing this. I'm not afraid. I'm going to do this. Stand up for myself and my division, all that stuff.
And then all of a sudden the phone rings and he picks it up and puts it on speaker. And on that phone is John McCain. And he, basically the conversation, I'm paraphrasing, it's like, hey dude, how'd I do last night? Because he had just finished his first debate with Barack Obama the night before. And I was like, what am I doing here?
I was like, you've got to be kidding me. I'm arguing with this person, nothing about small town country girl, right, you know, in terms of that mindset. And this, like, Power broker of like this, possibly the most powerful man in the world, you know, he's talking to and giving advice to like, this is ridiculous.
So we, we finished it. He hangs up. We finished our argument. I lose. And I go in my boss's office and I am pacing like a lunatic. I'm like, I don't know why I'm here. I'm not this. I'm not that all these things. And she had a glass office. So I'm sure people thought I was like losing my mind. Cause I'm pacing and hands are flying everywhere.
And she's laughing at me. And she's like, are you done yet? I said, yeah, I'm done. She goes, sit down. And she goes, you are here because you're not part of the problem. You are here because you're not afraid to have the hard conversations. You're here because you will hold people to task and come up with the right solution.
And like, that was the very first time in my entire career. That I was told that my differences were the whole point of me being there, and I had been playing close to the vest and kind of small up to that point. And so I think anybody who has that feeling like they don't fit, they don't look like everyone else, they didn't come through like everyone else.
We all want to blend, we all want to belong. But when you realize that, holy crap, I've been sitting on this for years, you know, and I could have used this, you know, and then, and so I think, I just think it's, it's, the story's worth telling for those of us who, I think it's everyone who at some point in time, like we felt a lot.
Laura Rotter
I was just going to say, I think, It's an interesting tendency that most of us have. Feel like we don't belong, we're too young, we're too old, we're too this…
Tammy Alvarez
We're too that, we're not enough of that, whatever, right? So yeah, yeah.
Laura Rotter
So Tammy, I am very curious how you Decided to leave the job that you were in for a decade that you felt comfortable in and also what was going on for you financially throughout your 20s and you know how your finances may have informed your decision since we know that that was an important catalyst for you.
Tammy Alvarez
Absolutely. And so the reason that I left after nine years was I had started a technology division, you know, for manpower. It was again biotech and engineering and I team brand new. You know, we had just in the training division and partnered with IBM and now we're doing this thing. And quite frankly, it was like the Wild West, right?
Going back in time, it was like during the Y2K. com era. And so in this industry of technology, staffing and services, I mean, it was a land of milk and honey. And so I saw this as an opportunity to surge and grow financially. And I did. Right. So I may, I just turned into quite frankly, I turned into mercenary mode and, you know, led various professional services organizations, basically whoever paid me the most one, because at the time I had just had my daughter, you know, and my husband was a stay at home dad.
And so I was the primary, the only breadwinner.
Laura Rotter
And so I shared that we both have that in common.
Tammy Alvarez
Right.
Laura Rotter
We had stay at home dads.
Tammy Alvarez
Yeah. And I loved it. I mean, you know, we both were built, you know, we did what we were built to do. Right. And, uh, and no regrets. It was exactly how our family, you know, benefited the most, but I took a very, very aggressive approach to career moves at that point.
So like during that whole, you know, 98 to 2005 ish area, you know, it was just continuing to move fast and move, you know, where the money and where the opportunities and where the growth was. Because for me, and it's interesting because I still have hangups on this, you know, money and all the finances still gives me anxiety.
And it doesn't matter how much or how little is in the bank. I have the same visceral reaction, like to the point where when I started this business, I hired my financial partner before I made my first sale because I knew I needed adult supervision. It's like, I'm not going to do this. It gives me anxiety.
I'm happy to make it, bring it in and spend it, but I just don't want to know, you know, and so I like to stay informed. I just, you know, just, and so I say that to bring it back to be like with that focus on income. You know, then that really informed, you know, I think income and growth were both kind of neck and neck in terms of the reasons I would make moves, you know, because then moving from the services industry, which we serve Wall Street clients, you know, into Wall Street.
And that's where I was really able to step up and grow, you know, that, you know, that was all driven by, you know. Following the paycheck, the opportunity, the wealth building, like through stocks and things like that.
Laura Rotter
And also from a leadership perspective for my growth. Nada, thank you so much for answering the question.
You seem like you were very intentional about your moves. Were you offered positions because people met you through your role at Manpower?
Tammy Alvarez
Yeah, not Manpower actually, but through, because I moved back to New York Metro once I left there. And so most of our clients were Wall Street. And so it was our customers.
It was the people we did business with. It was other vendors that we partnered with. You know, when you're leading sales teams, which I was at the time, your job is to connect everyone and, you know, to, to make, to build that community. And so it was very natural and very easy. You know, to be able to do that and, and make those connections, you know, to, and the opportunities would always come to me, which was really interesting because the first move I made, so I left manpower and I made this move and that's when my husband stopped working and, you know, and all that kind of fun stuff.
And I was in this new role, I was there for about six months. I loved my new boss. And keep in mind, this is my second real job, right? I was in a manpower for nine years out of high school. So this was my first shot at like saying, okay, is this a weird situation or can I actually do this again? And love my boss.
He was great. And of course the market was great. So about six months in, he got a new role and he left. And so, his regional guy and I did not see eye to eye, and we were still living paycheck to paycheck at that point, and, you know, we were living well, but we didn't have anything in savings, and about six weeks after my boss left, I got fired.
Now, notice, No warning. Out the door that minute. Two weeks of pay. That's it. Benefits are shut down. Absolutely. So that was a lesson for me. I was like, holy crap. Like, okay. So then I lay on the couch and cried for three days and felt sorry for myself. And realizing I never should have left. You know, we'd been fine there.
I could have stayed there for a long time. All those things. Not realizing that the market was strong. And so I'm like, all right, I'm not going to feed my family laying on the couch crying. So I better do something. And I had started to put my resume out there and I felt like a free agent. I mean, the phone was ringing off the hook.
The offers were coming through. And it was a very fortunate time to learn an important lesson, right? In terms of. Like making sure that you have a plan B and that you've got some backup funds and, you know, and things like that. So we didn't at the time I got lucky because of my industry and the timing, you know, and I think that was another important money lesson I learned pretty early in my career.
Laura Rotter
Thank you for sharing that. And I want to reiterate actually two things that I heard. The first you just said, and I will repeat, which is have an emergency fund of three, six, maybe even 12 months of your necessary expenses, because The job market is not what it was like for our parents. We don't have positions forever.
The other thing I heard, which I actually was talking about with someone yesterday, which is it's important to be excited about a role. It is just as important for our listeners who are considering a career change to another W 2 employment to be excited about the people you're going to work with and the team because that will influence how you feel about Your job day to day.
I have seen people say, Oh, that project sounds amazing. And they leave a team where they have emotional support, where they have support for their professional lives and understanding and appreciation of how they work. And suddenly they're working for someone who doesn't appreciate them at all and could potentially have your experience.
It doesn't have to be that bad. It could just be knowing you're going in every day. to knock your head against the wall to try to communicate with someone that doesn't, doesn't communicate the same way. Right. Or appreciate anything. Right. So, yeah, absolutely. So thank you. An important share for our listeners.
Yeah. So that was around early 2000 now that you joined Wall Street?
Tammy Alvarez
Yeah, it was, it was mid 2000s. Right. So, and then that's when I, I spent the rest of my career and it was fun, you know, cause the banks were big enough for me to move and shift and get different roles. So I was able to grow in place in terms of, you know, companies really easily.
I mean, I've been in positions from sales to audit and everything in between. And cause I always had that mindset that if you don't like it, change it. And so for me, my passion came in three different ways. I also believe you need to be passionate about something in front of you, not wait for it to hit you in the head and show up one day.
And so the first thing I get passionate about is the work, right? And then if the work was a little dull, which has certainly happened in my career, then the second thing I get passionate about was the people that I led and that I served. And their career and their aspirations and what they want to accomplish.
And if that didn't work because I was surrounded by a bunch of people that I didn't love, then I focus on my growth. Right? And am I growing? Am I having an opportunity to move forward in my career and develop as a leader? And then when none of those were around, then it was time to make a move. And I wasn't afraid to do that.
And I think in my career as a transformation expert, so we were always, you know, running into the burning buildings, you know, as as teams were running out, you know, in terms of the crisis management and personal, you know, financial services has that all the time. So we were never bored time. But I think it was really interesting.
One move that I had made. And that was my first time as a Chief Operating Officer for a division. And as a Chief Operating Officer, I had access to everyone's comp. Because that's what I did. I managed the financials and, you know, the people strategy and all that stuff, right? And it was just part of the executive job.
And I was floored when I saw how the comp got structured. And who made what. And all that stuff. And I was like, oh my goodness, like, you finally, I got the playbook. To realize, like, how underpaid many women were, and still are, you know, and people, male or female, that were incredibly valuable, but just sucked at politics.
And how they got treated from a compensation perspective. And it was probably one of the most enlightening moments in terms of how the game is really played in all corporate, not just financial services and how compensation is distributed. And when I had made the move after that, because I was in there for quite a bit, I loved that job, and I kept in that COO space for the rest of my career.
I was so glad we did the negotiation over the phone, because I was getting a new role outside the organization. And the offer came through, I was talking to the executive, and I was driving, and we were talking about compensation. And I doubled my income requirements. Without any apologies. I'm like, I want this number.
And he paused for a hot second and he said, no problem. I was like, shit, . I was like, I went too low. , right? You're the best for like, I went too low. You know, it didn't call, it didn't hurt him at all because that is how underpaid, you know, when I realized the spectrum of the market, I was like, this is ridiculous.
And knowing that there was zero pushback for a significant increase for me, and it wasn't a small number by any means, and they didn't blink an eye. I was like, Oh, hang on a second here. And so I think that's important for our listeners to know is to understand your worth and your value in the marketplace.
And this goes beyond a quick Google search on Glassdoor, right? Really understand this because from a company's perspective, and it's not personal. And we talked to our clients about becoming that CEO of you, Inc. And when you start to treat your career like a business, you show up differently and you make different decisions.
But when you start to think about how businesses buy things. If they go for a subcontractor, everything from people, subcontractors to pencils, right? What is the best quality I can get for the least amount of money? That's how businesses buy is how they stay in business. And so you will only get what you're willing to settle for.
And you know, and if they fall in love with you and you're adding that value and you're being, you're able to quantify that value and demonstrate that then they will pay. I mean, I have moved mountains in my budgets to make room for people I couldn't afford. Because I knew that they were absolutely the people that I was going to bet on the future with.
And so, I think a lot of us get really hung up about the money conversation at work. And we feel like, oh, if we ask for too much, then they'll think we're not loyal. It's like, you're going to get laid off eventually anyway, so forget about the loyalty. And so it's just like you're trading services for compensation, you know, that's all you're doing.
You can love the work, the people, all the things, but this is absolutely a commercial transaction. And so I think people should spend some time getting really comfortable having these difficult money conversations at work because they're, they need to happen. And you've got way more control in every economy than you think.
Because when people, you know, I've gone through many recessions because I'm 100 years old at this point, and you know, when people are hiding under their desks and praying not to get laid off, that's the best time to search. And when you are doing that searching, then you are driving the organization through the chaos.
Instead of hoping that you make it and then, you know, so during those times where, you know, the economy was tanking and everything was gloom and doom, personally, I was soaring because there's opportunity and chaos every time. You just have to know how to do that. We help our clients do that, obviously, you know, because that's one of my, my superpowers.
But, you know, in terms of the money equation and the vulnerability and being paid what you're worth and all of those things. I think. Had I not had that insider intel, my financial situation and my career would have ended up very differently.
Laura Rotter
I love that. And I, I mean, I think certainly at the beginning of my career, I remember also finding out that I was very underpaid relative to others in similar positions were earning.
And I had interviewed for positions with headhunters where I don't think you can do it anymore, but they, you know, were asked, what is she earning? And they would. Tell them.
Tammy Alvarez
Yes, because no, it's not illegal. But yes, I said…
Laura Rotter
Don't you dare tell them what I'm earning because that's has nothing to do with this position.
And that made all the difference in the world in terms of again, it was early in my career, but I remember my first number of moves each time I at least doubled.
Tammy Alvarez
Yes. You know, we help companies try and unwind, but are these policies that make no sense, right? For example, and to realize that there are exceptions made every day.
So a lot of times companies have a policy, and I think it's well intended, I know it's well intended, that you can't get any more than a 20 percent comp increase if you get promoted. Yet if they have to hire from outside, they're paying 45 percent more. So on what planet does that actually make sense?
Right? It makes no sense. Or the well intended idea that, oh, you have to stay on your role for two years before you can post out and get promoted. Well, what better way to have your top talent go to your competition? And so if you are sitting as a business leader, do what you can to get rid of these things that are cutting you off at the knees.
And if you're an employee that is there trying to navigate, realize that exceptions are made every day. And you have to be the person that they're willing to make that exception for. But, you know, because life is mostly about what you're willing to negotiate, right? And, uh, and how you want to stand up for yourself and, and advocate for the things that you know you're worth and gives the value back to the organization.
Laura Rotter
Great, great advice. So I know you are now in a position where you run your own firm and give this kind of advice to others. I'm curious before, maybe while you describe how you move towards that. I know you're always learning. We started off by identifying how you're a collaborator and how you build trust, even without thinking about it.
What other traits did you develop as you progressed in your career?
Tammy Alvarez
I think the most, one of the most important things that I developed and It became very apparent towards the end of my corporate career, which informed this next move, right? So it's like, okay, I was leaning into this one piece that really, really lit me up.
And then, you know, it led to where I am today and where the team is today. And there became a point in time in my career where I was much more excited. And focused on helping my team members personally succeed than I was about my career, or even the business results to some effect, because we can always get the business results.
There's just different ways to go. And I just found I got so excited and fired up and just energized by seeing other people step into. Things that they would never have done before. Recover from setbacks and get big wins and learn and grow and, and continue to develop. And so that part of my executive career, which was towards the, the end is when, you know, the last five years or so is when I really lit into this, that really informed why we started the business.
And why I start a career winner's circle because there's so many high achievers out there that just feel sidelined and marginalized and they're not getting where they want to go. They feel failed by the system and all these other things. None of that has to be true. And, you know, and so that's kind of how, and I remember because the moment talked about that purpose, you know.
And either, you know, the work, the team or, or my growth. And I remember the day that my corporate career got its final death sentence, you know, and I didn't know, you know, and I was like, we had just missed earnings again. And we're all in the boardroom and we're waiting for our boss to come in just to rip a Sunday one.
Cause this is what happened to every quarter. Cause we really Almost never made earnings. And then the game of volleyball would start. So we would start to blame each other on whose fault it was this quarter, right? It's like, oh no, sales sucks. No, operations didn't do anything. This and that, compliance is in the way, whatever.
And it was actually fun. It was kind of a sport. And so, and then we'd go out, we'd all go out afterwards and have a beer, you know, or something stronger and go, and go from there. And it was just part of what we did. And so we were all just sitting there just waiting for it. And, you know, he comes in, he is hot, hot, hot.
And I just remember feeling like I had one of those out of body moments. Where you're floating above the table, kind of watching what's going on, but disassociated. And I just didn't care. And I remember, I call it in my book, I got, you know, I developed a disease. I didn't know it was terminal, but it was called, I called it, I don't give a shit itis.
And I had this massive case of just, I could care less about any of this. And six months later, I had cashed out of Wall Street, moved to a tropical island off the coast of Belize in Central America and started this business, you know? And so that was probably one of the most terrifying things I'd ever done.
Yes, I would say so. You know, willingly leave a role that people aspire to have. Like, you made it. And then it's like, yeah, it's not working for me anymore. Kind of don't like it anymore. I want to do something different. And, you know, and that was probably the most terrifying thing I've ever done. And I thought it was really interesting.
Cause when I did that move and I pulled the plug and, and made that big shift again, cause I knew it was time for me to do something very different because another company, a new shade of lipstick, wasn't going to do it for me anymore. A lot of the people that I've worked with asked me, why was I giving up?
And I was like, I am taking one of the biggest risks I've ever taken in my life. And they see it as just giving up because I am walking away from what they wanted and what they've always wanted. And so it's just really interesting as we think about our perspectives, what good looks like, you know, what success looks like and what our goals are, you know, that for me, I always need to keep checking in.
Because I'm like a five year old on a sugar high, right? I change all the time. And so like, have you ever had that time or worked with a client that has that moment where they finally achieve what they want to achieve? They're excited. And then about a few months later, they're like, is this all there is?
Like, I worked so hard for this. And what that means is that the goal post moved on you and you didn't check in and you've been running the wrong race. And so we all have seasonality, and I think there's been so many things in our lives over the past 10 years that have caused us to rethink what good looks like, what success is, challenging the status quo, that if we don't continually check into the seasonality of our lives and our careers, and make sure you're running the right race.
Because you work really hard to get wherever you're going and it's be, you know, it's just really disheartening when you get there and you realize, oh, this is not what I wanted after all.
Laura Rotter
Yeah. I mean, I, I know I've read about, you know, suicides of famous actors we know, and that the worst thing that can happen is sort of what you were describing, which is you set a goal in mind, right?
You're talking about C suite roles in corporations, but perhaps becoming a famous actor or something and you achieve it. And you still dread Mondays and don't have, and, and it feels like hopeless. Like, I was like, now what? I set out to do and now what? I'm wondering, you've asked the question. I always end the podcast with before I, Reiterate that question and have you answer it for your, your life today, Tammy.
I'm curious. Did you, when you made this last leap or this recent leap, did you now have financial resources in place? Did you know you have a runway? What made you comfortable financially to take this big jump off?
Tammy Alvarez
Yeah. The thing that made me able to do this comfortably were. Fully vested stock options.
I got a giant paycheck for the next three years. That's what made me be able to do this very comfortably, you know, and that's really, I think, you know, negotiated, navigated well in terms of contracts and things like that. I would have done it anyway, you know, so had I not had this, I would have done it.
Regardless, because it just wasn't going to work. I was just out of passion, out of love with it. And I can't live in an authentic life in any part of my life. It's just, it takes too much wear and tear. And so, but it wouldn't have been as much fun, right? Like when I started the business, I didn't know what I was doing.
I thought I did, of course, because I was managing 2000 people in 35 countries. So of course I thought I could figure this out, realizing one has almost nothing to do with the other. And so it took me a while to figure that out. But you know what was interesting is that because we lived in Belize, like my partner Steve and I, we're big scuba divers and so we would go diving two or three times a week before work.
We'd go pop in, get salty, go play with the fish and be back in by ten. I was like, this is awesome, right? I love this part. But yeah, it was weird because I still had to get over the guilt of not being in the office. I was like, for what? Like, who's basically, no, one's missing me yet. No one even knows I'm in existence yet.
And so, you know, being able to have that financial freedom, like had I not had, you know, the nest egg and the stock options, you know, that were the gift I kept on giving for three years. Then I wouldn't have been able to have as much fun setting this up and experimenting. Like, for example, with the scuba diving thing, I would have never done that if I needed to make money immediately in my business.
You know, the other thing that I think was interesting is if I didn't have that, like my, I purposely started the business on a business to consumer sales model. I went B2C on purpose. Because I knew that if I went B2B, that I would go back into doing the work that I was still addicted to. I still love transformation and drama and all the things.
And I knew if I went back to the environment, like most people who start coaching or consulting go right back where they came from, right? Because that's your connections. That's your network. That's what they're comfortable with. It's the ego relationships and you can get new deals in 2. 5 seconds. And so, so I wouldn't have been able to say no for three years.
Learn B2C and detox, because then you can come back at this with a fresh mindset, which is what we've done. And so, you know, so now we do both. We serve B2C and B2B clients all over the world. But that financial freedom gave me the room to play and the room to experiment. And that has made all the difference in CWC being the organization that it is today.
Laura Rotter
Thank you. So please tell us about CWC. You've said we several times, so it's obviously bigger than yourself. So exactly what is it? Who do you serve? How do you serve them?
Tammy Alvarez
Absolutely. So it used to be just me, but not anymore. So we've got six coaches on the team and some amazing support people that are behind the scenes making all the magic happen.
And we really focus on three primary areas of service. Whether it's coaching, consulting, or a mix of both. So we do help mid to senior level leaders pivot out of the soul crushing grind. And move into a career that serves them without having to take a pay cut. Or sell everything and live in a yurt. Right, so most of our clients are making on average about 20 percent more.
When they move into a new role that they love and there's a whole secret sauce behind that. So we serve that community. We serve leaders. You know, who are kind of stuck in the middle, right? You want to be a good leader, but your company's making bad decisions, or, you know, your people are just burnt out and just done.
And, you know, we talked about that apathetic haze. And so we work with leaders to really modernize their leadership skills so they can be that glue that connects everything together. And then we also work with businesses and we've got this new offer that I'm very excited about is called Amplify 360.
And then the latest, you know, my, my latest mission, if you will, which I am on literally, it is a purpose filled mission is to eradicate the apathetic haze that has taken over corporations. People just don't care anymore. And there's a million reasons why.
Laura Rotter
And we don't feel cared for. So I should. All of it.
Tammy Alvarez
Right. Exactly. You know, there's, there's, you know, there's a million reasons why this is, but the beauty of it is there is a fast and easy way to fix this. And so we've developed this program that takes a three pronged approach. And what it does is it awakens that dormant force that's lying within your organizations.
So without changing any people, any processes, or any services or products, when you start to do things just slightly differently, you start to get people leaning back in again. And engaged and caring. And we do this with a three pronged approach. We show their people how to be that CEO of their career. We show leaders how to foster that mindset, not squash it.
And then we show organizations how to look at their policies and, and the things that they're doing. Some of the things that we talked about in terms of salary caps and things like that. And how do you unwind those well intended ideas so the whole organization can start to grow again. And at the nucleus of this is having that ability to take a unique individual's ambition.
Why do they get out of bed in the morning regardless of what they do and connect that ambition to the company's hardest goals. And when you do this, and it's, we have like a two month sprint that gets these companies started, the results are absolutely astounding. And the big aha moment for me with this was when I wrote the book, because the book is written for the disenfranchised worker.
Like, if you hate Mondays, you need to buy the book and hire me or one of our coaches, right? But what I didn't expect is that companies are paying me to come keynote because they want their people to hear this message. And that was the aha moment for me. I'm like, Oh, hang on a second here. This is not what I expected.
And that need to awaken, you know, that force. And to be able to reignite that, you know, just that energy within a company, it's right there. And so showing companies how to do this well and quickly has been so much fun. And so that is our latest mission is to eradicate that apathetic haze and get everybody lit up again.
Laura Rotter
That's an amazing mission. And so you've sort of come back to B2B, even though you started as B2C. Yeah. This podcast, most of our listeners obviously are individuals, perhaps thinking for another job in corporate, perhaps looking to go out on their own. I'm curious just to make sure that they understand how your services could help them.
Tammy Alvarez
Absolutely. And so the best thing to do is start with an end with, you know, with a free consultation call, because really our superpower is helping individuals who are looking to usually they don't know what they're looking for, actually. And so that is really where we lean in and really help medicinal level leaders.
And it's an interesting transition because from a mindset perspective, in addition to starting to treat your career like a business, which even most executives don't do, you know, you also start to make this shift from being paid for what you do to being paid for what you know. And when you take that skill set and apply it that way in market areas that where those skills are in high demand and in short supply, you are just living your best life again.
And that is what we show individuals how to do, you know, and so we are absolutely here to serve in that area without a question, but these leaders are also dealing with companies. Right. They're sitting in organizations right now. And the fun part is like, you don't have to suffer much longer and you don't have to leave right away.
So it's like, how do you make the most out of the environment you're in now? So you've got that great mindset and you're making the best out of the situation that maybe has gone south for you. And then while you're making this not suck as much and you know, because a lot of times if you're really in that grind or if you're super burnt out, or if you're in an environment that's incredibly toxic, it's hard to show up as your best self.
And it's hard to make those good decisions for yourself. And so, uh, you know, we, we blend. Okay, how do we normalize where you are now to at least an adequate level? You're never going to love it, probably, but let's not hate it anymore. Let's get you stable while we're figuring out what your next thing needs to be.
Laura Rotter
Thank you for making that clear. But now I'm going to ask your question back to you, Tammy, which is how has your definition of success shifted during this long journey and perhaps even how your definition of financial success has shifted?
Tammy Alvarez
Yeah. So for me, my definition of success has recently shifted into this new mission.
Of eradicating that apathetic haze, right? My first, you know, my first was like, okay, let me never end up like my mom, right? And not, not have to go through history repeating itself. Then it's like, okay, let me stabilize my family. And then, you know, let me make sure I can run a business. So we all have seasonality.
And so from a business perspective, that was success. And now that we've got coaches and we're serving and I know that we are good and, you know, not worried year to year, like, Oh, what's going to happen? And we're growing and we're excited. It's like, now what? Like now that I know I've got a business, that's a, not a commercially viable side hustle, but a legitimate company that is helping individuals and businesses transform.
Like what change can we make on the global stage? Like, where can that impact be and where is it most needed and how do we serve? And so now that is my definition of success is, you know, working one company at a time, really getting rid of that apathetic haze and getting people back in the game again because everyone wins.
And so that is today, you know, from a financial perspective, you know, my idea of success is being able to make sure the company thrives. We're set for retirement and that we're able to give back now, right? And we're able to really focus in on helping and supporting, you know, organizations and initiatives that are also doing their thing to help make this world a better place.
And so, you know, from a financial perspective, that's where, that's where I'm leaning in from a success perspective now.
Laura Rotter
I love that. It's a great message and a great mission. So thank you so much for that, Tammy. Is there anything you want to be sure you say to our listeners before we end our conversation?
Tammy Alvarez
Don't fail to act, right? It's a great conversation. I've loved our conversation. So, you know, thank you so much for the, for the platform, but what's the difference between a good idea and a good life? Is action. And so your best move next is to, you know, reach out to us at career winner circle, you know, we have complimentary conversations with everyone just to see where you're at, what you might want to think about in terms of your business or your, your personal career, but take advantage of that.
And use, you know, tap on the brains of an expert for an hour to see what blind spots you might have and what other alternatives you might have available to you.
Laura Rotter
Thanks again. I will include all of Tammy's information in the show notes. So you reach out to her. I'm so glad we made the time to talk to each other.
Tammy, this has been such an important. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Tammy Alvarez, CEO of Career Winners Circle. And some of my takeaways are, what you thought was your Achilles heel may actually be your superpower. As Tammy moved up the corporate ladder, she began to hide from others that, as she described it, was a country girl who hadn't attended college. She had imposter syndrome before it became a thing.
Over time, she came to realize that the fact that she saw things differently and wasn't afraid to have the hard conversations was actually why she was so valued. My second takeaway, make sure you have a plan B, which includes an emergency fund. Tammy stayed with her first employer for nine years, taking on more and more responsibility.
She then left and was in her second job for six months. When the boss she loved left and she was let go, she and her husband had no savings cushion. Luckily, she was bailed out by the strong job market, but she learned her lesson to always have a plan B and a backup emergency fund. And finally, If you don't like it, change it.
Tammy shared that she sought to find passion in three different ways. In the work she was doing, in the people that she led and served, and in her own growth and development. When none of those were accessible, then it was time to make a move, which she was never afraid to do. If this has struck a chord with you and you'd like help creating your journey towards both financial sustainability.
And passion about what you're doing. Please don't hesitate to schedule a call with me. And are you enjoying this podcast? Don't forget to subscribe. So you won't miss the next episode. And if you love the show, a rating and review would be so greatly appreciated and will help others too. Just like you to find it.
Thank you so much.
Narrator
Thanks for listening to making change with your money. Certified financial planner, Laura Rotter specializes in helping people just like you organized, clarify, and invest their money in order to support a life of purpose and meaning. Go to www. trueabundanceadvisors. com forward slash workbook for a free resource to help you on your journey.
Disclaimer, please remember that the information shared by this podcast does not constitute accounting, legal, tax, investment, or financial advice. It's for information purposes only. You should seek appropriate professional advice for your specific information.